Although I have been computer savvy since the early 90’s, I never spent any real time looking up the gaming community online. When I returned to gaming after several years off in 2008, I got in touch with most of my players on tha’ internets (before it had always been friends or friends of friends). That worked out well (in the long run), and around that time I started spending more time looking into D&D and other game communities. Damned if I was ever going to a con or hanging out at a store again, but the web seemed to be a great place to hear commentary and stories about gaming so I threw my hat in the ring.
My biggest surprise was the (heavy at the time) huge amount of debate over the various editions. Old School vs. new. I should have foreseen it really, but I was shocked that the community was huge enough to support an edition war. When I returned to gaming, I thought that Magic the Gathering and video games would have all but turned rpg tabletops into a thing of the past, played only in this tiny niche. Who would have thought it was still big enough to support all kinds of argle bargle.
So mostly younger people were arguing for the new editions, while mostly older folk reminisced (and even still played) with the golden days of 1st edition D&D and prior. After getting involved in some online threads and starting my own blog, I have come to realize that there is something even more insidious than edition wars. There are tiny little wars within editions, especially that regarding 1st edition. I think in the past I heard the quote “… bayoneting our own wounded…” in relation to the old school, and I realized better what that meant in the last few days.
I have long since left rpg.net behind. You just could not make a comment or tell an anecdote about your gaming without many of the locals starting arguments about gaming and telling you that you are wrong. That is one of the things I hate to hear the most in gaming from or for anyone – “you are doing it wrong.” If everyone is having fun at the game table, then nobody is doing anything wrong.
I don’t want to mention the names of sites (other than that one already mentioned), because the particular one I am thinking of right now has a ton of great old school resources and I would not want to denigrate that. But I have had some fun posting to the threads of that “site that shall remain nameless,” but realized that it seems to have some of the asshole overflow of rpg.net. Especially in the 1st edition AD&D forum, where I thought I could actually connect with other olds school enthusiasts, there are always a handful of people waiting to poop in the punch bowl. There to tell you that you did this and that wrong, or that your players are taking advantage of you, or that you are cheating as a DM, or whatever. Most shocking to me was one of the creeps telling me I’m a cheater because I have some house rules. I found that to be totally jaw-dropping.
No matter what you did in a game, some arrogant prick drops by with a negative tone to kill your buzz. And unlike rpg.net which seemed to be teeming with snarky younger dorks, the 1st edition forum is mostly older folk, my age or older. Unfortunately many of those older guys seemed to have had a lot of bad game experiences (I suspect due to their people skills), and they pass along their bitterness about it by crapping on other people. It’s maddening, because you go in to share and open up a bit about your gaming, but that is when the sharkes cruise in. Mostly because they have nothing better to do.
If I remember correctly, James at Grognardia used to spend much time at the site I have hinted at here, and stopped spending time in the forums just like I am going to do now. Just like me he talked about it with respect for its resources, but the threads are just full of bile. Let’s face it, the game blogging community is where it’s at, and we have actual presences with our blogs, which makes us at least a little bit more responsible for our words and attitudes. A fellow blogger will call you on the B.S. - and much better that than some 22 year old punk who thinks he plays the game better than you, or some bitter and lonely codger who gets his jollies by projecting his bad gaming past on you. Yep, bayoneting our own wounded.
Outside of the blogs, I am involved in the European folk music community, and in that scene you have these old musos and hippies with grand, happy tales of music past. Everything spoken of with respect and playful glee. I was hoping I’d encounter something like that in relation to the old school gaming community outside of the blogs, but I guess that, ironically, was a true fantasy.
Still Out There, a Short Update
8 years ago
It's not just the increased snark on the forums, there's usually a much lower signal-to-noise ratio as well. I don't have time to wade through 30+ page threads on a daily basis hoping to find something of value. I just find it easier to scan blogs and quickly pick stories I'm interested in reading. :)
ReplyDeleteWe're here for you, Bruno. :)
ReplyDelete& Thank you for changing the colour-scheme! :D
Stuart: Right - I really started by combing through older threads looking for discussions on rules that I was interested in other views on. My mistake was actually hitting the threads as a presence. I should have just kept lurking and kept my yap shut. Just cause I'm hanging out at a bar doesn't mean I have to interact with old drunks.
ReplyDeleteTS:Thanks for the tip. Ease of reading is way better than white on black 'cause it looks cool n' stuff.
Well, maybe if you would just play the damn game right you wouldn't have these problems.
ReplyDeleteThat's a great analogy. I should put that on a post-it-note on my computer to remind myself not to get drawn into it again.
ReplyDeleteOn the site that shall not be named, I once commented to a friend about the really annoying snark there and how detrimental it was to any newcomers hoping to pick up interest in the old ways. He said something that made sense: "Most of those guys aren't running a game and aren't playing a game due to personality disorders; they are bitter because you and other people are running games and playing in games, and their only joy is disrupting your happiness." It made sense and I look at some of the posts with that in mind.
ReplyDeleteFor the most part though other people's opinions of my games are meaningless. If they aren't gaming with me, who cares. I know the guys I play with, house rules and all, with the hated 2E rules, are having a blast. That's all I need to know.
If it's the site I'm thinking of, I never really had a problem. there are a couple on there that I just glaze over their posts and ignore. As my grandmother used to say (RIP), "Just look at like they're a stump." :D
ReplyDeleteAs to bloggers policing ourselves, I just wish people would comment at all on mine. lol.
Fitz: Good burn, meanie.
ReplyDeleteBadmike:Damn straight. You are a man of wisdom, my friend.
A lot of old school blogs are hitting their 2nd birthday and the rise of blogging has been a liberating thing, helping those with a passion for the game share the love without the crap slinging of the forums (well, mostly). The sort who make the forum experience depressing have been increasingly marginalised in a couple of old school forums. That sort don't write blogs because nobody would read them.
ReplyDeleteIt's not all bad on the forum front however. Goblinoid Games and Original D&D Discussion forums are two places where people can get passionate about the game without the idiots picking a fight or hurling abuse. Either the wanker filter is really strong in those two places, or the wankers can't stand people being nice and showing respect, either way between forums like that and the blogs, thankfully we can still get together with like-minded folk online AND enjoy the experience. :-)
I second Mr. Macauley's recommendations. The OD&D forum is fantastic and ditto for Goblinoid Games.
ReplyDeleteDavid/James: I will for sure check those places more - after the bayonet wounds close up a bit...
ReplyDeleteI try to avoid places frequented by grumpy old farts and smart-ass kids in equal measure. I blog and read blogs because I want it to enhance my gaming experience. Arguments and negativity bring me way down. Coming from the Risus community*, I'm not all that used to it. Out motto has always been "There's No Wrong Way to Play."
ReplyDelete* Not entirely Risus. I did used to hang at EN World and the SJ Games forums, but I stopped going there mostly because I was spending too much time there for too little gain. It's much easier to find the cool stuff by wading through my blogroll (or blogs linked from those sites).
I do think that the larger forums (in terms of membership) can be a real drag (and I think you've survived the system shock ;)) - it's the more smaller, more focused boards that have a better 'pay-off' (ODD74 & knights & knaves are stand outs this way as far as I am concerned)
ReplyDeleteI no longer find any value in online forums dedicated to anything. I'm with you, Bruno....the blogging community is the place to be.
ReplyDelete....until someone starts a fight about ascending vs. descending AC. :P
knights & knaves...stand outs this way
ReplyDelete@Ragnorakk - I'm not trying to cause trouble but did you read Brunomac's post? If so would honestly recommend K&KA to someone who has just expressed the above feelings? I think it's a recommendation that many at K&KA would even find surprising. :-)
Ragno: Ha ha, nice. Luckily in my world you only lose a point of Con when you fail an SS (uh...I guess...I dunno)
ReplyDeleteDavid:I guess as long as I am a bit reactionary online, I can expect that almost anywhere. I just have a hard time not speaking up when somebody drops a load into the hot tub. So I'd best just keep away. Enough negative stuff in life, right?
Well - I'd say that there's a no-bullshit vibe at the alehouse that tends to chase off the trolls. Sure, there's some bile and other stuff flung about, but it never hits the ridiculous lengths of a Dragonsfoot, and the regulars aren't the ones doing it (except to each-other sometimes for fun). For 1e reading/discussion/conversation I personally can't think of anyplace I'd rather go.
ReplyDeleteI poked around the Alehouse a bit this weekend. So far liking it.
ReplyDelete